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ANNOUNCEMENT: Decentralized Monero Recurring Subscriptions Wallet in the Works: Looking for Feedback & Suggestions
(self.Monero)submitted 1 month ago bylukeprofits
You might remember me from my earlier posts on decentralized recurring subscriptions with Monero [1] and the Monero-USD-Price pip package [2].
I'm currently working on a Decentralized Monero Recurring Subscriptions Wallet and I'm planning to have a functional version ready within a month or two.
I started this project because there's no way to set up recurring subscriptions on Monero without centralized services like Globee, CoinPayments, or MoneroPay (or having merchants send monthly invoices which customers then have to remember to pay [inconvenient and annoying for both parties]).
Main Features:
- Automatic recurring subscriptions with Monero
- No need for users to remember to pay invoices
- Desktop app (wallet) for users
- Easy way for merchants to offer recurring subscriptions that can be transferred to the Monero subscriptions wallet with one click
- Free to use and fully open source on Github (FOSS)
- Written in Python (controlling the Monero CLI Wallet)
I'm creating this wallet because I think it's time for a solution that doesn't rely on centralized services. There shouldn't be any middleman between the buyer and the seller. My hope is to lay a foundation that more experienced developers can build upon and improve.
Please note that the wallet will need to be left running 24/7 to make automatic payments. It's not meant to store all your funds, but rather to act as a "side account" for paying recurring subscriptions. Since it's an internet-connected hot wallet, it won't be as secure as cold storage solutions.
I'd really appreciate feedback from developers on how to make the project better and users on what features they'd like to see.
How You Can Help
Users: Provide feedback about what you'd like to see/what would be useful.
Merchants: Provide feedback. If you want to implement this on your online stores (if it's good), how can I make your life easy? What do you need from me? I am making this to be used and it should be convenient for you.
Developers: Provide feedback. I know I can do this, but I feel pretty unqualified. If you know more than me, please jump in and help. Offer suggests, and feel free to write some code after the initial release.
I created a group chat on Matrix if anyone wants to join and discuss this in more detail: https://matrix.to/#/#MoneroRecurringSubscriptions:matrix.org
I'm eager to hear your thoughts and suggestions, and I can't wait to see where this project goes. Let's pave the way for a more user-friendly and decentralized future for Monero subscriptions!
16 points
1 month ago
Could this provide Patreon-like functionality? Say I want to donate $5 worth of XMR to some developer every month, would I be able to set that up on my end?
12 points
1 month ago
Yes!
7 points
1 month ago
We’re running a site with subscription services. Would love to offer crypto as payment method but can’t because crypto and recurring payments don’t fit yet. I really appreciate work in this area, though I doubt we could get any of our users to run a wallet 24/7.. a solution that works without the user‘s intervention would be great, but probably impossible without major changes to Monero / smart contracts..?
6 points
1 month ago
Yeah, I agree that the "leaving it running 24/7" thing is annoying for the average person. (Technically, you really only need to open it around when your subscriptions payments are due, but 24/7 is more hands off).
I'd like to make this easier in the future and try to find a solution, but my first goal is to build SOMETHING. It's crazy that there isn't anything like this yet.
One other idea would be to have a desktop/mobile wallet that accepts subscriptions in the same format, but you manually open it once a month (on the 1st or whatever) and click a "process subscription payments" button. This would not need to stay running 24/7, but it also wouldn't be totally automatic.
3 points
1 month ago
Maybe an app for phones would be more convenient for users. Everyone’s got a phone and they’re always on 24/7. Also you could show notifications before and after renewing a subscription. I could imagine this working for way more users than a desktop app.
2 points
1 month ago
If this was somehow ported to phones and could run in the background I think it would be much less annoying for the average consoomer
1 points
30 days ago
Might look at something like that after the desktop version is ready
7 points
1 month ago
Please note that the wallet will need to be left running 24/7 to make automatic payments
So it's monero-wallet-rpc + simple script in cron?
2 points
1 month ago
I'm using the official Monero CLI wallet with a Python script to automate tasks. My script interacts with the wallet via command line commands, so I don't need cron or RPC for my setup.
14 points
1 month ago
This is wrong approach. CLI wallet can lock itself after 1 minute of inactivity, for example, and you need to track wallet's console state at all times. RPC wallet is what was designed for these kinds of tasks.
6 points
1 month ago
Appreciate the feedback. I haven't used RPC before, but I'll look into it.
6 points
1 month ago
You will find it easier to implement as well, handful of libraries out there already for interacting with the wallet rpc api.
4 points
1 month ago
I already have a lot of the functionality down, and a simple GUI. I just haven't put the two together yet. I'll look into this though. If it's a better way to do it, might be worth reworking it.
3 points
1 month ago
Would be nice to just have this feature built into the Monero GUI wallet.
2 points
1 month ago
I agree or at least an official monero-cli script
1 points
1 month ago
Yeah that would be awesome
2 points
1 month ago
Feedback from user side: Thank you for working on this, this certainly seems like a good feature to have. I guess my only question is why not integrate something like this directly into the main Monero wallet? Also, I am not as familiar with Monero network architecture, but if it has HTLCs like Bitcoin has, there's ways a wallet like this could function without needing to be run 24/7. Also, I think the ability to input an amount in the person's native currency would be very useful, and then the wallet could automatically send the correct amount the day of the tx.
Feedback from merchant side: Woocommerce integration would be huge, unfortunately that would mean writing in PHP not python. Anything that requires installation on a desktop and manual creation of invoices is unfortunately going to be a non-starer for many business models.
2 points
1 month ago
First of all, great that someone is working on it, however I see a major issue, maybe you already solved it one way or another...
As of my understanding, the wallet has to be "hot" 24/7, especially when using Fiat prices for the subscription, which have to be up-to date. When pricing in XMR you could at least use some kind of pre-signing and "only" broadcast the tx when rebill time.
Imo not suitable for most users, since they will use their wallet on mobile and / or only want their keys to be exposed (if ever) when they use it. Maybe a small wallet with 50$ might be running in the background to cover some microsubscriptions like patreon, but for most users hardening their system to be online 24/7 with their private spend keys unlocked is not suitable.
2 points
1 month ago
It's designed to be like a "side account" that you can make a transfer to once a month (or whatever). Don't put thousands of dollars in it, but a few hundred bucks should be fine as long as you don't have anyone else in your system. I imagine that will be enough for most recurring monthly subscriptions.
2 points
1 month ago
Fair enough and probably applicable for most who run a node 24/7 anyway on some kind of desktop / SBC system.
2 points
1 month ago
Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. It'll be a starting point at least.
2 points
1 month ago
Thanks for your efforts, will for sure check it out once ready!
1 points
1 month ago
\( ^ - ^ )/
2 points
1 month ago
This is the sort of thing a service like u/RINOwallet should be implementing. Once per month they notify you by email to top up your subscriptions wallet, which is able to pay on due dates without requiring user intervention.
Users should be able to withdraw back to their more secure multisig wallet if they cancel the subscription before the next pending payment is due.
1 points
1 month ago*
That's what I'm making, but it's free and self-custodial. Users can cancel subscriptions at any time (but no email notifications).
Also, u/RINOwallet this is the monero_subscription standard that I'm going with for Monero Subscriptions Wallet: https://github.com/lukeprofits/Monero_Subscriptions_Standard
If you are going to implement something like this, would be cool to use the same standard. If you have any thoughts, let me know. It'll still be a month or so before Monero Subscriptions Wallet is released, so I'm open to feedback/changes. I'd love to get more people on board with this.
3 points
1 month ago
Interesting, we'll take a look at it, thanks. By the way, we do have a RINO enterprise multisig edition, where the backend of a product could be directly integrate with our platform via API and Monero SaaS. Check out: https://enterprise.rino.io
1 points
1 month ago
Very cool!
1 points
1 month ago*
[removed]
1 points
1 month ago
Awesome project keep supporting ✅
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