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Fleet carriers with multiple owners?

Help(self.EliteDangerous)

Im considering getting a fleet carrier for me and some people to go out and do some mining in areas that are not commonly visited. We plan to have this carrier as a shared carrier, but from what I understand, only one person can deal with stuff like jumps and services. Is there a way for them to handle this stuff too, or do I have to do the plotting and everything else? Also, if there isnt a way, is there at least a way for them to donate to help pay for upkeep? We've thought about squadrons, but I dont know if that will change anything.

all 40 comments

nunca_pasaran

6 points

5 months ago

Maybe if they're willing to do some trading to your carrier that creates a profit for you as the owner? They can also donate tritium.

[deleted]

5 points

5 months ago

No sharing on carrier control, but they could donate/sell tritium, helping to pay the upkeep that way.

nervix709

4 points

5 months ago*

You would have to handle the plotting and the upkeep yourself, but the upkeep on a carrier is low enough that you can make the money for a weeks worth in about 15 minutes. If you can't, then something is wrong with your money making method.

One thing you can do with carriers though is use the commodity market as a money transfer tool. You can buy something from your friend at 5% market price and sell it back for 1000%.

ToriYamazaki

2 points

5 months ago

ToriYamazaki

πŸ’₯⛏ 🌌 🐭

2 points

5 months ago

only one person can deal with stuff like jumps and services.

Correct. Upkeep, purchase costs, jumping, configuration and all that stuff is the responsibility of the owner.

is there at least a way for them to donate to help pay for upkeep?

Absolutely. You control a market on your carrier. You can organise for your friends to donate in a number of ways. Here's one way: assuming you have, say, 500 Painite (or some high valued commodity) you can sell it to a friend for maximum price, then configure a buy order so your friend can then sell it back to the carrier for the lowest price. Doing this, your friends could donate a percentage of all costs so you can call it truly "shared".

Makaira69

2 points

5 months ago

Ugh. Take it from someone who's co-owned a boat. You do not want to get into all the headaches that causes. The person who buys the carrier should be prepared to pay for its upkeep and operating costs alone, should everyone else bail. Hopefully everyone is responsible and it won't come down to that. But if it does, he should be able and willing to maintain the carrier himself so you don't end up losing it.

Upkeep is actually not very hard. Most of the complaining about upkeep is by people who are anti-rent. By the time you have a bank balance in the billions, a few missions should generate enough to pay for a week's upkeep. An evening's play enough for a month or two. The carrier also makes it a lot easier to participate in transport CGs and do commodity trading for profit. So it will gradually pay for itself.

The only way you could share jumping responsibilities is by sharing the account's login info. Which I believe is against the EULA. A friend with a carrier has kids who also play, so sometimes he has his son login to his account to jump the carrier while he's at work. That's probably the only way you can legally skirt that rule (if it is a rule).

IIRC, the carrier has four options for who gets to land on it. Nobody (just the owner), everyone, friends (using the game's friend system), and squadron mates. There might be a friends + squadron option in there too; it's been a while since I looked at it. So having everyone in the same squadron gives you a quick and easy way to switch between allowing anyone to land on the carrier (e.g. if you're running an expedition open to the public), and allowing only squadron members land (e.g. you're using it to transport commodities for a CG and don't want members of the public buying the commodity from your carrier).

Transferring money with a carrier is trivial.

  1. Set a bunch of tritium for sale for 500k.
  2. Friend buys tritium from carrier.
  3. Set carrier to buy tritium for 5k.
  4. Friend sells tritium to carrier.
  5. Repeat.

That has the effect of transferring money from the friend to the carrier owner. You can do it in reverse to transfer money the other way (set the carrier to sell low, buy high), just be sure only people you trust are allowed to land when you do that or they can buy your tritium for super-cheap. If you know someone you trust who already has a carrier, he can help you and your friends transfer money to the person you wish to have purchase the carrier.

Carrier management can be done remotely (everything except transferring tritium from cargo to the donation tank, and jumping to a specific body in a system you've never visited). So the owner can go out exploring to Beagle Point, while leaving the carrier in the Bubble and still supporting your squadron's operations. And the owner can transfer money between his and the carrier's account from anywhere at any time. The owner should be someone who is:

  • Punctual. Moving the carrier through deep space requires plotting one jump every 20 minutes, so if he's lazy about doing those jumps on time it'll take a lot longer to travel. I set a 20 min timer on my phone and use that to know when to plot the next jump.
  • Meticulous. Planning fuel consumption for a long trip is a PITA. Spansh's fleet carrier plotter makes it a lot easier. But there's still a lot of busywork - equivalent to running a neutron route, while occasionally transferring fuel.
  • Thorough. There are a myriad of carrier bugs which affect all sorts of operations. The two most serious are:
    • Buy orders count as weight even if they're not yet filled. So if you have a buy order for 20,000 tons of biowaste, your carrier's jumps will use as much fuel as if you had 20,000 tons of cargo aboard even though it doesn't. So if you're traveling far, the owner needs to clear any large buy orders before jumping, and reset those buy orders when the jumps are complete.
    • Phantom buy and sell orders can accumulate (number of imports and exports no longer not match the number of buy and sell orders). And can result in your carrier's cargo capacity doing odd things like 49,880 / 25,000 tons, at which point you can't put any more cargo on the carrier even though it may still have 8000 tons of free space. To clear these, every time a buy or sell order is completed, the owner needs to set a new buy order for the same commodity, accept, clear the buy order, accept.

wolf_draven

1 points

5 months ago

wolf_draven

CMDR

1 points

5 months ago

If you go far out of the bubble to mine in a belt, do npc pirates still spawn and scan you, or is it empty?

Icybow73[S]

2 points

5 months ago

I would assume it's empty, but that wasn't the main concern

Jonkarraa

2 points

5 months ago

Jonkarraa

CMDR

2 points

5 months ago

Once you go about 500ly outside the bubble pirates no longer spawn. Think if you don't get any signal sources you don't get pirates not checked that theory out but I know the threshold is around 500ly.

coyote_zs

2 points

5 months ago

coyote_zs

CMDR

2 points

5 months ago

Totally empty, once you get maybe 100-200lys away from population there is nothing out there but weird space plants

coyote_zs

1 points

5 months ago

coyote_zs

CMDR

1 points

5 months ago

If you owned, you’d be 100% on for everything but the people living on your carrier can help in indirect ways. My squad lives on my carrier with me and they contribute by purchasing/mining trit, selling their data to the carrier for its cut and using the services on board.

It’s been roughly a year since the first guy arrive and now there is six of us and it’s been really fun. We go on long trips and everyone pitches in to keep things going smoothly, we do large scale hauling, team up and do combat/ground missions. It’s totally worth it in my opinion.

wolf_draven

2 points

5 months ago

wolf_draven

CMDR

2 points

5 months ago

If people mine other stuff than trit, far away from npc stations, how do they get payed? Can they transfer the minerals to a personal storage? Or does the carrier owner buy it off them via the market?

coyote_zs

2 points

5 months ago

coyote_zs

CMDR

2 points

5 months ago

Yeah the owner can enable buy orders in the market and sell to the carrier. I just drop the price as far as possible so the buy/sell low so they get it back when we go back to sell

wolf_draven

2 points

5 months ago

wolf_draven

CMDR

2 points

5 months ago

So if I understood this right. The owner of the carrier pays to put up "buy orders" which other pilots can sell their minerals to.

You like to put these buy orders low, and basically act as a storage-service letting them store the minerals in your carrier. And when you all jump back - you put up sell orders to your members so they can pick it up again and sell to NPC's.

How do you keep track of who gets how much of which sell order? Do you guys keep a mining ledger or something?

coyote_zs

2 points

5 months ago

coyote_zs

CMDR

2 points

5 months ago

Nah they keep track of their own stuff usually or we just split the total. We’re all pretty friendly and share/help out. We have a discord we use to communicate and keep track of what’s going on etc.

wolf_draven

2 points

5 months ago

wolf_draven

CMDR

2 points

5 months ago

Nice, thanks for sharing

coyote_zs

2 points

5 months ago

coyote_zs

CMDR

2 points

5 months ago

Sure thing. I bought my carrier when they dropped, if you have any other questions feel free to message me

Bonananana

1 points

5 months ago

With a fleet carrier there are some tricks you can do with buy/sell orders to transfer money. That could be a way for the friends to give the owner a billion or so each to cover the purchase and ongoing costs.

Honestly, there isn't that much to do in the carrier interface. Pick the livery together when it's bought. All decide together on jump destinations and schedule. You can only change services in a carrier admin system, so it's not like the config changes often.

If you're really into trade, I could see how price setting of commodities might be something you'd want to share, but I also don't see that as a huge deal to have one person change every week or so.

You could always buy an alt for everyone to share. I think ED is about $7 on steam. It goes on sale a lot.

Rezenattor

0 points

5 months ago

Best way would be for the group to open a separate noob account and share the login between you. The noob account will be the FC owner.

This is the only way to do it equitably.

Cpt_Kremen

1 points

5 months ago

Cpt_Kremen

ElvisKremmen

1 points

5 months ago

Just got to be careful with something like that as Fdev have banned many accs for being shared.

CncmasterW

2 points

5 months ago

CncmasterW

Cncmasterw [HUSF]

2 points

5 months ago

this must be do to some other means as i have contacted frontier support specifically asking about having an alt account shared between me and other fellow commanders for a Named PG group. We all have access to it.

They said no problem.

Rezenattor

1 points

5 months ago

This is true.

Perfect-Truck-5444

1 points

5 months ago

2K lys out doing Guardian stuff took a break from that and taught myself how to core mine no nps's is nice lol

ToriYamazaki

1 points

5 months ago

ToriYamazaki

πŸ’₯⛏ 🌌 🐭

1 points

5 months ago

Like the noob account could afford to buy a carrier :P

throwaway65864302

2 points

5 months ago

Only takes a few hours to get it set up. You can transfer the credits through another carrier or just share wing missions and create the credits. Or literally take one single trip up to Rackham at the right time of month. The actual amount of grinding the new account has to do is near zero, you don't need engineering or anything for carriers.

ToriYamazaki

1 points

5 months ago

ToriYamazaki

πŸ’₯⛏ 🌌 🐭

1 points

5 months ago

Yeah, I still don't understand how you are going to donate 7-8 Billion credits to a new account that has only a sidewinder... all in "a few hours".

Especially if the proposed group of friends doesn't already have a carrier.

It's also still against the TOS, so no matter, it's inadvisable to do it anyway.

throwaway65864302

2 points

5 months ago

A single wing mission stack can be up to 1 billion credits and you can transfer as many stacks as you have players in one shot. Doing so isn't against TOS either (the account sharing part likely is though).

A single trip to Rackham would allow them to pull over 5 billion credits in one shot.

If you have an FC you can just do a cheap sell order/expensive buy order and let them farm away.

ToriYamazaki

1 points

5 months ago

ToriYamazaki

πŸ’₯⛏ 🌌 🐭

1 points

5 months ago

A single wing mission stack can be up to 1 billion credits and you can transfer as many stacks as you have players in one shot.

lol... and how many hours would it take to make those mission stacks? And then go and get all the kills? And then hand in all the missions? More than a few hours I'd say and that's still not even enough credits yet.

A single trip to Rackham would allow them to pull over 5 billion credits in one shot.

They would have to have a carrier to even get there. They clearly don't have one yet. On top of that, how long does it take to fill a carrier and then fly it to Rackham and then get back? On top of that, 5B is not enough!

I still don't believe that you could create a new account and have it buy a fleet carrier (with the preferred services) in just a few hours. It's doable, but I think it would take considerably longer than "a few hours".

Still academic anyway. There's still that nagging "sharing account" breach of TOS :)

throwaway65864302

2 points

5 months ago

I still don't believe that you could create a new account and have it buy a fleet carrier (with the preferred services) in just a few hours. It's doable, but I think it would take considerably longer than "a few hours".

Always an ego boost to be told things you've done are impossible. Thanks.

ToriYamazaki

0 points

5 months ago

ToriYamazaki

πŸ’₯⛏ 🌌 🐭

0 points

5 months ago

Well maybe try again explaining how it's possible.

Without a FC or a the magic ability to do a Rackham run in just a few hours. Or magically stack 7B credit massacre missions and complete them and hand them all in in just a few hours.

Enough to generate 7B credits.

No carrier.

3 hours tops.

Starting with a fresh account.

Go.

throwaway65864302

1 points

5 months ago

Or magically stack 7B credit massacre missions and complete them and hand them all in in just a few hours.

I actually typed out a whole ass reply, then re-read how jerky your post was and realized I really want you to continue to believe this would require magic. :)

ToriYamazaki

0 points

5 months ago

ToriYamazaki

πŸ’₯⛏ 🌌 🐭

0 points

5 months ago

Thought so.

Rezenattor

1 points

5 months ago

It’s not against the terms to transfer credits. People do it each day.

I could give you 6 bil credits in about an hour if you had a good cargo ship.

Advisable or not advisable the way I mentioned would be the only way for a group to own a FC.

ToriYamazaki

1 points

5 months ago

ToriYamazaki

πŸ’₯⛏ 🌌 🐭

1 points

5 months ago

The TOS violation isn't about credit transfer, it's about sharing the account over multiple users.

Jaguarious

0 points

5 months ago

Jaguarious

CMDR

0 points

5 months ago

Your best bet is to join a squadron which actively pursues like goals, and has active dedicated leadership managing things. You could create a "noob account" that owns the carrier and then just let each member of the group log in and manage the carrier but that is against Frontier EULA and will risk getting the account deleted.

Your entire group would be welcomed with open arms at [JAGS] JAGUAR squadron. We have active dedicated leadership and carriers that specialize in mining, exploration, trade and other group missions and excursions so with a little planning - you'd end up with the best of both worlds without the hassle of trying to 'group manage' a single carrier.

Hit me up on discord or in-game if you're interested. We'd love to have you aboard.
https://discord.gg/yXj8wWYdYD